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The Unbelievable Privilege of Being a Male Director

Features
by Melissa Silverstein
May 14, 2014 1:00 PM
52 Comments
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To say this post is a long time coming would be an understatement. I've been thinking about it for months. But last night I was pushed over the edge so here we are. The line that women directors hear from the folks in Hollywood is that they don't want to "risk" a tentpole film, or quite frankly as the statistics show, any film on a woman director. That goes along with the line that women just don't have the experience to direct these movies. 

That my friends is a giant big pile of poop. 

They have no problem hiring men with no experience or promoting men from low budget films to the big leagues. It's not about risk, it's about gender. This is about male privilege and the belief that untested men can handle films better than women with experience. How can we believe that this is about experience when last night Paramount hired writer Robert Orci to direct the latest Star Trek film. This is a man WHO HAS NEVER DIRECTED A FILM BEFORE.

Please tell me how it is not risky to give a person around $170 million for a first time directing gig. If this was the only man being given the keys to the kingdom like it is his playhouse, I would keep my mouth shut (well, maybe not.) But this happens ALL THE TIME.

Here are some additional examples of men who have never directed before, and also those who have made the huge jump from an indie feature to a studio film.

First Films

Robert Stromberg - Maleficent - budget $200 million (release date May 30)

Wally Pfister - Transcendence - budget $100 million (released)

Andy Serkis - Jungle Book - no budget yet (yes, there are 2 Jungle Book movies happening)


Second Films

Colin Trevorrow - Jurassic World - second film - budget $150 million; 

1st film - Safety Not Guaranteed - budget - $750,000

Gareth Edwards - Godzilla - second film - budget $160 million; 

1st film - Monsters - budget - $500,000

Marc Webb - The Amazing Spiderman - budget - $230 million

1st film - 500 Days of (Summer) - budget $7.5 million


I know there are many others that I can add to the list. I just wanted to get it started. Please add info in the comments and we will continue to add to the piece.

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52 Comments

  • Goliath | July 17, 2014 7:25 PMReply

    I believe a concern for the male dominated field could be the fear of a one sided film. If there is a female director, the film can be preserved as feminist. May threaten the male counterpart’s stance in film. This is true for a lot of male directed film. The men are stronger, smarter, and more involved in a meaningful roles than any of the women in film. Why should this be of any concern?
    Risk is not a valid argument if referred to talent and experience. This is purely sexist. Women can produce exceptional products with a verity of different flavors to put into their films. The argument can be made that people would not accept women directors, but it’s a new era and that is highly unlikely. I think the industry is worried about the term feminism. It is miss understood and sounds very powerful. Women directors’ equal man hater films in the eyes of irrational people who don’t understand the term. There is a lot of room for people to make their own interpretations.

  • Tonie | July 16, 2014 5:26 PMReply

    It's telling that many "indie" directors with little or no experience can raise $500K or $750K. Like it or not, men are perceived as being able to handle the money. The resulting films tend to be more polished than micro-budget films, and they receive greater critical latitude. The buzz for these young, white male directors stays with them as they move into Hollywood. Some very lucky and well -financed women share the same fate (Lena Dunham, Sophia Coppola), but mostly it's an uphill battle for women, as well as under-represented minorities and poor folk of every strip.

  • Miriam | July 16, 2014 5:23 PMReply

    Andy Serkis has served as 2nd Unit Director on the Hobbit films. He has plenty of directing experience for a large-budget film, I'd say, particularly given the scope and massive army-marshaling those films require, and his deep personal/technological involvement in so many big-budget films. Personally I'd leave him off this list as an example of simple male privilege. He's played a very unique role in the development of film the past 15 years, and with all that acting AND directing experience on massive films, I'd feel quite confident handing him a film like Jungle Book.

  • Daniel | July 12, 2014 11:35 PMReply

    Line three. 'or quite frankly' requires a comma after the adverbial clause.

    Maybe if you were as prepared with your grammar and criticism as the men you mention are with their story-telling abilities, you might have some increment of awareness as to what is necessary to plan these tent-pole films. They present concepts, pre-visual art, visions, beyond the stories they have already proven as being production-worthy.

    Women are supposed to be better at language than men, but you have shown to have niether talent, as your little tirade on men's success exposes.

    Stick to your blog.

  • Tonie | July 16, 2014 4:56 PM

    Easy there cowboy, it's "neither" not "niether." We are make hasty mistakes, right?

  • ana | July 11, 2014 2:05 PMReply

    awful,

  • Anouk | July 10, 2014 10:06 PMReply

    With the exception of Chris Larson and Michael Rigler, I get the feeling that most of the men participating in this conversation are emotional 15-year-old boys and not film professionals who happen to be men. Is it just me?

  • Steve | July 10, 2014 6:19 PMReply

    If you think this has anything to do with gender and nothing to do with money, then you're sorely misinformed on how the film industry (or any industry) works.

    To say that he was given the chance because he's a male is to be willfully shortsighted.

    He was given the reins to direct because the producers feel he will provide the best return on their investment. NOT because he is a male.

  • Catherine Campbell | May 30, 2014 8:16 PMReply

    It's about the female philosophy, duh! They want male to be everything and that's why the amature male writers get everything...called geniuses and they maybe they are...spinning that same old shiite into a new story means new chase, new sex scene, latest female star beauty to ravage and male great body, great guns...and voila the latest tentpost to foist on 4000 theaters...and say that's what the american public wants...it's NOT, and the boys in charge know it! Are we still falling for the "oh women can't handle it myth...with their awards, and great films???

  • Julie | May 29, 2014 2:30 AMReply

    Yeah, hopefully, there will be more females given director gigs. Fingers crossed. :)

  • Calum | May 25, 2014 2:27 AMReply

    "Please add info in comments"? You mean, write the article for you?

    As a film student and "privileged white male" on benefits who lives in community housing and can barely afford $60 a week for food, I can assure you less women are interested in filmmaking than men. We have one woman in all three classes. Women work well with the production side, and guys are great at creativity. It's a fact. Now, the only thing I agree with you on is Orci. There's film politics going on there, and that's got nothing to do with gender. The "second film" seems like a petty cheap shot to prove hatred towards males, and is irrelevant from your actual point.

    It's great to say "where all the women?" It's another thing to say "are there actually any women who want to be directors?"

  • Anouk | July 10, 2014 9:49 PM

    Great comment Tosh! I usually skip over stupid, idiotic comments - and let's be honest, it's not misinformed or even misguided, it's just plain stupid- like Calum's but I'm just so sick of shite! Calum, perhaps you need to backtrack to middle school again because you're definitely not ready for film school even if you are just a "privileged white male" film student.

  • marky mark | May 28, 2014 1:12 PM

    dude, your biggest problem is youre a film student

  • Tosh | May 27, 2014 8:27 AM

    Calum, I honestly despair when I read comments like these. I'm willing to think you might have a point, that you might have an interesting perspective based on your experiences at film school -- but then you say something as narrow-minded and foolish as "Women work well with the production side, and guys are great at creativity. It's a fact." My dear, I suspect you will struggle on benefits for as long as you attempt to be a film-maker. Your perspective is hackneyed, you have no capacity for nuance and you think in bland generalizations. To be able to type that sentence out and mean it is stunning for its lack of self-awareness. Film only opens up to people who think like that if they are seriously well-connected or just very rich. I'd give up if you're not. Also: the fact there are not so many women in your class doesn't mean women don't want to be filmmakers, it might mean there is bias in intake, or indeed (as many women who make their first films in their 40s attest) a message going out to young women that filmmaking isn't for them. By people who, say, spout inanities about how men are creatives and women are producers.

  • Alp | May 19, 2014 2:22 AMReply

    I know your meme says it, but uh that title should really read "white male directors". Harvey never ever gave that kind of budget to Robert Rodriguez

  • Sarz | May 16, 2014 4:06 AMReply

    I've worked in the film industry for 12 years, in that time I've worked with many first time directors so far out of their depth it's almost comical. Some were taken off the project early, they were so inept. All were cocky males. Certainly first time female directors might be just as bad but there's no way they could be worse. Hubris is a hell of a sword to fall on and it seems to be a primarily male problem.

  • venom of the day | May 16, 2014 1:07 AMReply

    Talent can take you there, but only character can keep you there.

  • Dustin Schwindt | May 15, 2014 9:47 PMReply

    These kinds of articles always feel a little bit like shouting at the rain. I heard this kind of conversation a hundred times in film school and it always bothered me because I felt like it was directed at men in general and that the only action suggested was to "let" women direct. Meanwhile, the most talented directors and cinematographers in my department were women who I would have no trouble working for.

    Baseball was integrated because one owner opened the door and the individual players that walked through the door were just really good. After that it was all about money. Politics has been integrated because women ran for office and won elections (but unfortunately we still haven't had a woman president, partly because some women don't vote for other women).

    If this is to be solved in Hollywood it will come only partly through patronage and mostly through audacity, persistence and excellence. It's a hard truth about any process of integration, but until the playing field levels, women will just have to be better at their jobs then the men around them. That or start their own giant production companies and make more movies like Zero Dark Thirty and The Hunger Games.

  • Chris larsen | May 15, 2014 9:12 PMReply

    I'm a white male, I'm a camera assistant and I work on features and commercials. There is a massive amount of privilege for white men, and men in general in film. I have worked for female DP's and female Directors and they were perfectly competent. Women are underrepresented in almost all departments of crew. There is a problem in all departments from the bottom up, and a lot of departments act still exercise a boy's club mentality. I've seen progress and I always try to hire my female assistant first. It's a long road and articles like this will help, despite all the people taking offense because they don't want to see it. With filmmaking becoming more affordable to entry level artists, hopefully there will be more diversity in films, and that will effect the big budget films.

  • Nancy Alexander | May 19, 2014 10:44 AM

    My favorite part of your comment is "they were perfectly competent." The late, great Bella Abzug said something like the goal was not to see a "female Einstein become an assistant professor. We want a woman schlemiel to get promoted as quickly as a male schlemiel." Not only do women and other underrepresented groups get hired and promoted less in many/most fields, but there is a documented double standard by which they typically have to be more qualified than white men. So let's add to the goal that perfectly competent women get hired, at every level, at the same rate as perfectly competent men!

  • Josh | May 15, 2014 2:56 PMReply

    Maybe women can't direct? Maybe the reason women aren't behind big action movies is cause they don't like big action movies. Not to say of course there aren't women who do enjoy those films or work in that genre, but you're speaking for all women directors here.
    And you're taking naive, dumb, cheap shots at men here. Wally Pfister is a LONG time DOP. He knows his stuff. It was an easy transition. Andy Serkis is a long time MoCap professional. So don't say these guys are coming from nothing.
    Men have proven themselves as great directors, name 3 great women directors.
    Rest my case.

  • LAVERNE | May 22, 2014 2:16 PM

    Your mother must be so proud of you.

  • Victor Morton | May 15, 2014 5:53 PM

    I don't know about you, but when I think about "superheroes" or "Hollywood tentpoles," and who'd be ideal to direct one ... the first name to come to my mind is Chantal Ackerman. Wait wait ... no no ... it's Claire Denis. And ... well ... more than half the names on that list would be as or more awesome directing such films. Surely the only possible reason Daniele Huillet has never made a Sylvester Stallone actioner is that the sexist Jean-Marie Straub was holding her back.

    Also at least Alice Guy, Leni Riefenstahl, Larisa Shepitko, Yuliya Solntseva, Ida Lupino, Marguerite Duras, Shirley Clarke, Germaine Dulac, Lotte Reiniger, Barbara Loden ... all haven't made any films recently. Obviously the Big Bad Patriarchy. Well that ... and Howard Hawks, Henry Hathaway and Don Siegel hogging all next year's summer blockbusters.

  • B | May 15, 2014 4:54 PM

    To Willow: <3

  • Willow | May 15, 2014 4:45 PM

    Jane Campion
    Chantal Akerman
    Sofia Coppola
    Claire Denis
    Kathryn Bigelow
    Maya Deren
    Elaine May
    Claudia Weill
    Lana Wachowski
    Lizzie Borden
    Alice Guy
    Mary Harron
    Lynne Ramsay
    Ann Hui
    Lucia Puenzo
    ldiko Enyedi
    Yuliya Solntseva
    Larisa Shepitko
    Kira Muratova
    Lina Wertmuller
    Ida Lupino
    Marguerite Duras
    Gillian Armstrong
    Andrea Arnold
    Liliana Cavani
    Shirley Clarke
    Byambasuren Davaa
    Germaine Dulac
    Daniele Huillet
    Samira Makhmalbaf
    Yvonne Rainer
    Lotte Reiniger
    Margarethe von Trotta
    Barbara Loden
    Catherine Breillat
    Leni Riefenstahl
    Sarah Polley
    Dee Rees
    Sally Potter
    Verena Paravel
    Michelle Maclaren
    Kimberly Reed
    Kimberly Pierce
    Kelly Reichardt
    Debra Granik
    Ceiline Sciamma
    Amy Heckerling
    Julia Loktev
    Marleen Gorris
    Jennie Livingston

    There's 50 off the top of my head throughout the history of cinema. Want me to continue?

  • Maria Giese | May 15, 2014 1:04 PMReply

    Orci is insignificant. The whole argument, however, is fascinating and relevant. It points precisely to why women should be hired at parity with men across the board in film and television. There are no required qualifications for directing, therefore women should be directing 50-50. Everyone director must have a "first film." Orson Welles' first film, "Citizen Kane," is often cited as the greatest film ever made. When guys like Orci get these mega-budget movies to helm, it demonstrates the arbitrary nature of our industry that does not bother with the hard-won civil rights laws we American's are so proud of, and tout around the globe as a signifier of our moral superiority. Orci's hiring provides us the best argument of all to combat the ludicrous arguments against equity for women directors: that men have more experience. Without the "experience" position, there is no other viable excuse that gender ratios among directors are so bizarrely skewed (96:4 male to female) except for unlawful discrimination against women. The new president of the Directors Guild (a TV director) says on Twitter: "Why not?" to Orci's getting the job, yet when it comes to hiring women for TV gigs he says (to paraphrase) "Directing is not an entry-level job." The message to the studios should be "Hire whoever you want, but drop the hypocritical BS about why only 4% of American studio features are directed by women." Hollywood is not Hollywood DC, a jurisdiction that exists outside of US laws. Employment parity for women is happening in even the most conservative sectors of our society. Why not Hollywood?

  • Noelle | May 15, 2014 12:32 PMReply

    I agree with you. I do just want to say that Orci has a HUGE track record as a writer and producer and Pfister is an award-winning cinematographer. So perhaps they've earned the opportunities. HOWEVER, so has Ellen Kuras and has she been handed the keys? No. And many more like her. Someone like Michelle MacLaren had powerful (male) mentors who believed in her and gave her a chance and she ran with it. It's about being given the chance and opportunity and so far it's mostly to members of the White Male Club. This is an issue for African-American directors as well of both genders. Thanks for posting. It's a conversation that needs to continue until the problems stop. We're missing out on entire world-views.

  • B | May 15, 2014 4:56 PM

    And even MacLaren doesn't seem to have been offered a big screen work yet. If anyone deserves to be making films for Marvel and the like it is her.

  • Becky | May 15, 2014 9:21 AMReply

    While I completely agree with your point, Andy Serkis worked as second-unit director on the Hobbit films... I feel like that's pretty significant experience.

  • Michael Rigler | May 15, 2014 8:10 AMReply

    I think this is the biggest part of the problem is clearly illustrated by the list of the 20 highest paid media executives in America (Google it!).
    Instead of getting directors' backs up and putting them in the position of defending their right to a particular job, maybe we could start looking at where they can influence positive change. For one, directors and producers get to choose who's on their crew. I would love to see more women working as DPs, grips, sound recordists, props ... you get the idea.
    There are some small signs of change in writing rooms but by and large, the WGA has equally abysmal figures for women and minorities. However, they're not the ones making the final script decisions. One of my biggest problems with the industry is the overproduced pablum that gets green-lighted for production.
    If Hollywood insists on sticking to tired, mysogynistic stereotypes and story lines then audiences won't have an opportunity to expand or change their appetites. If that doesn't change, then studio execs will be able to continue saying things like: "films with strong female leads don't sell" - a ridiculous argument considering they're the ones who tell the public how and what they should consume.
    If we want the numbers to change, I humbly suggest that we need to keep the spotlight on the rich, white men at the top who get to choose what gets made while doing whatever we can to provide opportunities for people who aren't well represented in the industry and desperately want in.

  • Miles Maker | May 15, 2014 4:49 AMReply

    To have lumped EVERY male director into this conversation is unfortunate. Simply Google the faces of the examples you've mentioned, and my point will be illustriously made.

  • Amazed | May 15, 2014 2:39 AMReply

    There are more female CEO's of Fortune 500 companies than there female directors of studio films. Percentage-wise, there are more female senators than females who wrote studio features last year, and twice as many female senators than female directors. The studios not only ignore female talent, they ignore the female audience. Anyone who suggests that there is no sexism in Hollywood is in serious denial. Show business is one of the most sexist (and racist) businesses in the world. Period.

  • SM | May 14, 2014 9:34 PMReply

    1st Films
    Jennifer Lee - Frozen - budget - $150mil

    This isn't to say that it is being balanced out, but that there is - at least - some change happening.

  • WhoaCalmDown | May 14, 2014 8:12 PMReply

    This is a ridiculous 'article' on a website that until now has always been impartial and actually a solid bastion of film criticism. This is just a rant with no substance.

    Instead of giving examples of men who have jumped from low to high budget, why don't you give examples of women who you think should be given the chance?

    And can you give these male directors their due before trying to bring them down? Edwards shot a film at $500K that looked like a budget 50 times that. And Orci has been working in TV/Film for 20 years now and is always on set and working directly with huge directors (Bay, Abrams, etc.).

    Get off your pulpit or stop drinking at work.

  • Brenda | May 15, 2014 1:24 AM

    Let me guess - you're a man.

  • AQUINNAHGIRL | May 14, 2014 9:33 PM

    Women who should be given a chance...just off the top of my head...

    Lesli Linka Glatter
    Michelle MacLaren
    Mimi Leder
    Patti Jenkins
    Lexi Alexander
    Leata Kalogretis
    Amma Asante
    Nicole Kassell
    Jan Eliasberg
    Dee Rees
    Kasi Lemmons
    Jennifer Getzinger
    Jamie Babbit
    Gillian Armstrong
    Jane Campion
    Anna Boden
    Susanna Bier
    Niki Caro
    Zoe Cassavettes
    Gurinder Chadha
    Cherien Dabis
    Agnieska Holland
    Ava duVernay
    Gwyneth Horder-Payton

    The list, as they say, goes on and on...

  • Sarah | May 14, 2014 9:30 PM

    If your rebuttal devolves into "stop drinking at work" you need to work on your rhetorical skills. That is some SERIOUS unfounded nastiness right there and it undermines your entire argument.

    Oh, but you know, of course women are just being crazy and irrational whenever they get passionately upset about something. *heavy sarcasm implied*

  • dali | May 14, 2014 6:26 PMReply

    that's interesting
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  • Laura Shapiro | May 14, 2014 2:11 PMReply

    In general, I passionately share your opinion, but I think this post lacks necessary granularity.

    Stromberg has won multiple Oscars and Emmys for his art direction and visual effects on high-budget, high profile films. Pfister is an Oscar winning cinematographer and veteran of many big-budget films, Serkis is renowned for his performance capture work on films with huge budgets. The reason these three men are considered qualified to direct these large, tentpole films when they are first-time directors is because they have specific and successful repeated experience working in key visual positions at that budget level, where visuals are a very important aspect. The same is true for Robert Orci directing Star Trek 3, though in his case his strength is in a track record of writing numerous films at that level. Gender aside, all these men have reasonable credentials for landing a tentpole film as their first directing job. They have relevant experience, maybe more so than the second group.

    The real issue here is that there are very, very few women who have that same relevant experience, at least in the realm of big-budget films. The problem is that there are not female equivalents for Orci, Stromberg, and Pfster. There are certainly female actors who should be elevated to direct, but there isn't anyone who has the specific position of Serkis as a ground breaker in performance capture - he's kind of a unique case.

    The case for the second time directors who moved from small budgets to tentpole films is more problematic from the gender perspective. It's hard for me to believe, in the abstract, that a person who directed a $500,000 film is automatically qualified to direct a $160 million film, but by many reports I've read, the new Godzilla is well-done and has elements that transcend the usual monster movie. My educated guess is that Edwards got in the room and pitched his more nuanced take on the Godzilla reboot and they went for it. Edwards, Webb and Trevorrow made really good and successful films the first time out; that's what got them in the room. Women struggle to make their first films, and they rarely get in the room as a result.

    I share your passion about this - my life has been profoundly affected by gender discrimination in the industry. But I think more a more granular discussion of how things work in the industry is necessary if we're ever going to get things to change.

  • Laura D | May 24, 2014 2:03 PM

    ...from under $1 mil to over $100 mil, that was supposed to read.

  • Laura D | May 24, 2014 2:01 PM

    To me, the crucial point is that women are just not trusted to make that leap from writer to director, from television to film, from $100 mil, or from DP/second unit director/other crew position to director. Let's be real - the stories of these guys are exactly what lots of young filmmakers hope for: to make a cool microbudget that gets noticed, or to spend years doing great work in a non-directing position, and then get tapped for a studio assignment. We want to be the person that studios take a risk on. The question is, why do 99% of the people who "make it" this way happen to be white dudes?

    The thing about sexism in Hollywood is that it functions on so many levels simultaneously. So it's hard for a woman to be in the same position as someone like Orci because women don't get hired - or even invited to pitch for - most of these big studio tentpole screenwriting gigs in the first place. There's a vicious cycle where not even getting in the door means you don't get the experience and connections you would need to be taken seriously - since, as some commenters have already mentioned, women need *more* experience to be considered as qualified as men with less. Then it's easy for studio execs to justify their decisions by saying, "Oh, there were no similarly qualified women," or for people to justify the status quo by saying women just don't want to direct, or don't want to direct big-budget action and sci-fi, and so the cycle continues.

  • Matt | May 14, 2014 1:35 PMReply

    500 Days of Summer was a great film. They clearly only chose Mark to direct the Spiderman film due to the hilariousness of his coincidental last name.

  • budmin | May 15, 2014 12:43 AM

    I've said it before and I'll say it again.
    1) Joseph Gordon-Levitt played the BEST Peter Parker archetype ever.
    2) The studios wanted a director who could bring women into the theaters.
    3) His NAME IS MARK WEB!!!

    All these directors are making films that are directly in their wheel house. It's just that the studios are giving them bigger budgets.

  • Hilary Swank | May 14, 2014 1:20 PMReply

    sigh. another nauseating and bitter article about women in Hollywood, with half baked research. Roberto Orci is on board with Star Trek 3 because he co-wrote the first two, so he's familiar with the environment and the story that he is taking on.

  • Sarah | May 14, 2014 9:32 PM

    Many women in the industry have gone on record that this issue is in fact a serious problem. Do a little research. (I also LOVE the microagressions you're spewing... of course a woman who's upset about a genuine discrimination problem is just "bitter"...) SMH

  • bwunderlick | May 14, 2014 7:29 PM

    LOL another nauseating and mindless comment.

  • Hilary Swank | May 14, 2014 1:29 PM

    take other things into consideration on why they were offered a job instead of being so hellbent on making everything about gender. "It's not about risk, it's about gender", really? Did you ask studio insiders or maybe anyone involved in the industry and that's what they told you? Or did you think "this MUST be the reason"?

  • George | May 14, 2014 1:13 PMReply

    This may not be the place to voice the opinion I'm about to give but here it goes. Whether there may be corroborating personal and anecdotal experience to validate this perception or not, there is a point of view that believes that women in a managerial position often invite drama and needless fraught relationships when they think "acting like a bitch" is the only way to get things done. Men are Assholes too but they run the studios. They're simply more comfortable collaborating with fellow men.

  • bwunderlick | May 14, 2014 7:26 PM

    Why all the hedging? Why not just come out and say women are bitches?

  • Pants Aflame | May 14, 2014 1:09 PMReply

    "They have no problem hiring men with no experience"

    Oh, really? Who's "they"? As a male trying to get his first feature off the ground, I can assure you that only having done shorts that played reputable fests is still a liability to investors. We need more women directors, but you don't need to lie to make your point.

  • PANTS AFLAME | May 14, 2014 8:01 PM

    The only reference to "they" is "folks in Hollywood." There's no stats here. No consideration of other factors.

    This article is a poorly-written live journal blog. In all capital letters, she shouts that Orci never directed a film. Sure, but he's written tons of big blockbusters. He's a hack writer who got a gig as a hack director. Big deal.

    Such things happen with women too. Or should we believe that Gia Coppola was given the blessing to direct solely for her talents? Or how about her star Emma Roberts?

    There are tons of men who have amazing talents who don't get jobs and end up working as waiters on their feet for 70 hours a week. Just like women. But instead this site has become an unbearable compost pile of live journal posts like this one.

  • bwunderlick | May 14, 2014 7:27 PM

    "They" are the people who hired the people men mentioned in the article.

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